A resurrection from 2007 today.

Discussion (36)¬

  1. Quine Duhem says:

    Barmaid, it is not quite that simple. There is voluminous philosophical discussion on Cartesian-style epistemic circularity. See, for example, these links:,, or Happy reading.

  2. Rebecca says:

    The Earth is the center of the universe and everything revolves around it in perfect circles… humans are the ultimate form of life… and I am important. Not

  3. M27Holts says:

    A lot of people lost their lives for stating that the sun is at the centre if the solar system. Your religious numb nuts are clearly mostly whopping liars, because I reckon a lot of them must have enough brains to realise that man made god in her own image…

  4. M27Holts says:

    In fact professing faith is just lying to yourself in the face of overwhelming evidence that a living god with special interest in mankind is just another manmade construct…

  5. M27Holts says:

    Oh. And the Marmite dichotomy is usually resolved when you realise that those know-nowts who like their “beer” ice cold and literally tasteless like alcoholic water are highly likely to detest the strong and deeply salty flavours of marmite. You should see their faces when they can actually taste and smell the sicky aroma of a proper northern bitter…

  6. Succubus ov Satan says:

    But the film ‘God on trial’ fairly concluded that ‘god’ is NOT good

  7. M27Holts says:

    Putting god on trial only encourages the deluded – no point in putting a fictional character on trial. Bit like those numbnutz in Hartlepool who hung a monkey because they thought it was a french spy…

  8. machigai says:

    Vortex of Epistemic Vanity is a good name for a Metal band.

  9. M27Holts says:

    Aye. Or a prog/metal band…

  10. Donn says:

    Proponents of heliocentric model:

    270 BC – Aristarchus (reported by Archimedes.)
    190 BC – Seleucus, who also explained tides caused by mass of the moon.

    1543 AD – Nicolaus Copernicus
    (rest of 16th century) – a dozen or so, including Galileo Galilei and Johann Kepler.

    As far as I am aware, the worst consequences fell on Galileo, who was put under house arrest.

  11. James R. Baerg says:

    Wasn’t at least part of what got Giordano Bruno killed, his pushing of heliocentrism?
    Somewhat worse than what happened to Galileo.

  12. jb says:

    “A lot of people lost their lives for stating that the sun is at the centre if the solar system”

    Is that true? There was Giordano Bruno, but even there there seems to be some dispute over the true reason he was executed. Anyone else? I can’t think of any. There were plenty of executions for heresy of course, but they were over much more important questions, like…, um…, whether Jesus was both true man and true God.

    Also, it’s definitely not true to say there is there is no evidence for the existence of God! There is plenty of evidence — that evidence being the testimony of people who say they have actually encountered manifestations of God. I personally find that evidence confused and unpersuasive, but I can’t deny that it is evidence. I’ve never been to Australia, and the only evidence I have of its existence is the testimony of others, yet I believe it exists.

    Also, I tried Marmite with an open mind, but that stuff is nasty!!!

  13. Shaughn says:

    @ postdoggerel: LOL
    @jb: Perhaps you took too much?
    Basically Marmite is a flavour enhancer, just like trassi or maggi seasoning. Just a little bit will do. I use it in soups, stews, fonds or in combination with butter and (Dutch) cheese on bread. Only real afficionados take it pure in massive amounts 😉

  14. M27Holts says:

    I reckon the inquisition introduced the red hot poker to the rectum of loads of people who told the spunk womble inquisitor that the Earth orbits the sun with the quip..”Stands to reason you pig ignorant numbnut!”….

  15. smee says:

    Jb Testimony is evidence in law. Not really scientific evidence. Its just anecdote.
    The existence of god is a hypothesis without evidence and will remain so until some is produced. A hypothesis with the same value as the one that says Elvis is still alive.

  16. Donn says:

    If evidence were given of “God”, that would be a great step towards defining the term in some meaningful way – and it would then be possible to hypothesize another God: the real God, who wouldn’t be so ordinary as to leave footprints.

  17. Laripu says:

    Here’s my definition: god is whatever brings my parents and pets back from the dead, young, strong, healthy and happy… forever.

    Any entity that does that will deserve my worship.
    Not possible? Right. That’s why I’m an atheist.

    Oh, and ‘life after death in a perfect heaven’ is an obvious false sales pitch used as a business enhancer by Jesus LLC, a wholly owned subsidiary of Religion Incorporated. It’s the Marmite of religious salesmanship. “Eat up, peasants.”

  18. Rrr says:

    Or, in Latin: Hocus Pocus.

  19. Donn says:

    We have a song – “The Preacher and the Slave”, Joe Hill, to the tune of In the Sweet Bye-and-Bye.

    Long-haired preachers come out every night
    Try to tell you what’s wrong and what’s right
    But when asked how ’bout something to eat
    They will answer in voices so sweet

    You will eat, bye and bye
    In that glorious land above the sky
    Work and pray, live on hay
    You’ll get pie in the sky when you die

    (See wikipedia etc. for more verses.) This is the origin of the term “pie in the sky.”

    The point here is both about the religion scam per se, and also its relation to society where it encourages the peasants to patiently accept their burdens in life in expectation of a reward that isn’t really coming.

  20. M27Holts says:

    Pie in the sky, I had two Hollands meat growlers on friday night, with chips , mushy peas and proper gravy. Think I won…

  21. Donn says:

    Just read an article reprinted from the Washington Post this morning, about lifestyle choices associated with regions where people often live to 100. First on the list, was to eat a cup of beans every day. That’s one way to win, and I reckon the mushy peas may count. I didn’t notice anything about meat pies.

  22. Choirboy says:

    Didn’t expect to see mushy peas above the parapet again so soon. They seem to divide opinion about as much as religion.
    Certainly can’t be beaten with a couple of growlers though!

  23. M27Holts says:

    Presume, the cup of beans are Haricot beans…I do eat a cheeky beans on toast lunch treat quite often…or skinheads on a raft round these parts…

  24. Donn says:

    No, haricot is the one thing they’re not, if I understand what you mean.

    Eat a cup of beans, peas, or lentils every day.

    Legumes are especially popular among people who live in Blue Zones. Soybeans are an important part of the traditional diet in Okinawa, as are fava beans in Sardinia and black beans in Nicoya. People throughout the Blue Zones tend to eat a variety of beans and other plant foods that are rich in fiber.

    (From wikipedia>

    Through continued research, the following five areas have been identified as blue zones:

    Sardinia, Italy*
    Okinawa, Japan
    Nicoya Peninsula, Costa Rica
    Icaria, Greece
    Loma Linda, California, United States

    *In Sardinia, particularly Ogliastra, Barbagia of Ollolai, and Barbagia of Seulo; A village called Seulo, located in the Barbagia of Seulo, holds the record of 20 centenarians from 1996 to 2016, which confirms it is “the place where people live the longest in the world”.

    Loma Linda is full of vegetarian Seventh Day Adventists.

    I understand haricot to mean green beans … and of course there’s nothing wrong with that. But they’re talking about dried beans. As it happens, I’m about to sit down to lunch with Lima beans – actually from Peru – in that category, which is confusing to Americans who are more accustomed to detesting this particular bean in green form.

  25. Choirboy says:

    Haricot beans are dried beans not green.

  26. Laripu says:

    On this Wikipedia page, you can find the description of the dried bean called (among other things) haricot beans:

    I know the word from French, where “les haricots” just means, simply, beans. In French it’s pronounced “lays-arico’, with a rolled r and the accent on the o. As such, and somewhat slurred, the word gave rise to the Louisiana style of music called Zydeco. In that context it meant green beans.

  27. Donn says:

    Saturday evening I used navy beans for a Mexican style dish, more or less in the role of “refried beans.” They’re versatile even if they are white. The typical item, “baked beans”, however, would be my last choice.

  28. Paul T Seed says:

    Giordano Bruno didn’t just claim that the earth went round the sun, he – mischievously – took the logic of the geocentric priests and reversed it.

    Geocentric Priests – “The earth is the centre of the universe, because Jesus Christ, the Son of GOD was born and reigned here.”

    Giordano Bruno – “Are you sure about this argument?”

    GPs – “Yes!”

    GB – “But we now know that the Sun is the centre of the universe. So by your logic, we should worship the SUN!”

    GPs – “That is blasphemy. As are your views on eternal damnation, the Trinity, the divinity of Christ, the virginity of Mary, and transubstantiation. We burn people who blaspheme.”

  29. Paul Seed says:

    As for marmite. Marmite tastes much stronger than anything else you are likely to spread on your bread. Most people who hate it spread it themselves, and put it no much too thick. Unless your mother spread it for you when you were a child, you will get it wrong.

    You do not need even the thinnest layer. If you have a layer, it is on too thick.

    As a child, as a boarding school with ghastly food, we used to sneak it into school in order to add some savoury taste to what we were eating. A very small jar, small enough to easily be hidden in a pocket, would last a whole term.

  30. Donn says:

    I know, who ever said any of this was supposed to make sense. But …
    1. “universe” is by definition unbounded, so how could there be a “center of the universe”?
    2. The priests’ argument for earth center doesn’t have anything to do with physics or geometry, so it isn’t necessarily in opposition to theories about the spatial relations with the sun and other planets.
    3. Since they don’t propose to worship the earth itself, the logic that they should worship the sun instead is not at all compelling.

  31. paradoctor says:

    Paul Seed: That argument leads to the conclusion that Jesus was born and reigned on the Sun.

  32. Son of Glenner says:

    Paul Seed, paradoctor: The Sun is not a very good newspaper, but I don’t think Jesus ever reigned over it. If he had been the editor, it would probably have been a whole lot worse!

  33. M27Holts says:

    And surely Jesus being part of a collective consciousness would have been able to explain the principles of Nuclear fusion taking place in the sun to his enthralled desciples. And given them a quick insight into quantum mechanics…

  34. Shaughn says:

    But he did, M27Holts.

    That was the moment the holy ghost was spirited into their minds – unfortunately they got delirious and forgot all afterwards. Just a tiny flaw in the Intelligent Design.

  35. M27Holts says:

    Aye. That or he didn’t exist as a singular human and its all a pile of steaming shite…


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