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	<title>Comments on: raft</title>
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	<link>http://www.jesusandmo.net/2008/02/22/raft/</link>
	<description>Two prophets, living together.</description>
	<lastBuildDate>Sat, 11 Feb 2012 00:52:27 +0000</lastBuildDate>
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		<title>By: fenchurch</title>
		<link>http://www.jesusandmo.net/2008/02/22/raft/#comment-175265</link>
		<dc:creator>fenchurch</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 13 Oct 2011 20:37:42 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.jesusandmo.net/2008/02/22/raft/#comment-175265</guid>
		<description>Hamidreza&#039;s bragging defense of Islam as an immutable and perfect word of god is hilariously arrogant as it is wrong.  

If you have more than one sect trying applying the rules laid out in a single untranslated original text, then even your own fellow religious can&#039;t agree on interpretation of this being&#039;s wishes.  
How is this divisiveness not reformation?  

The sect of Islam that is cool with depicting Mohammed is not the one burning embassies, I&#039;d imagine.

&quot;Perfection&quot; is a meaningless attribute for a text, amounting to no more than ad copy for the product.  It&#039;s like the vision of the Borg Queen for the universe, entirely subjective, and necessarily controversial.

Claims such as these beg to be argued against, by skeptics, against the Hamidrezas of the world; it&#039;s the indoctrinated, brainwashed, cowed followers that have no voice to fight back under threat of death due to apostasy.  We need to make the world safe again for critical thinking and freedom of expression.

Time to get the Federation to fight the Borg of religious monopoly on an individual&#039;s rights to think differently and question.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Hamidreza&#8217;s bragging defense of Islam as an immutable and perfect word of god is hilariously arrogant as it is wrong.  </p>
<p>If you have more than one sect trying applying the rules laid out in a single untranslated original text, then even your own fellow religious can&#8217;t agree on interpretation of this being&#8217;s wishes.<br />
How is this divisiveness not reformation?  </p>
<p>The sect of Islam that is cool with depicting Mohammed is not the one burning embassies, I&#8217;d imagine.</p>
<p>&#8220;Perfection&#8221; is a meaningless attribute for a text, amounting to no more than ad copy for the product.  It&#8217;s like the vision of the Borg Queen for the universe, entirely subjective, and necessarily controversial.</p>
<p>Claims such as these beg to be argued against, by skeptics, against the Hamidrezas of the world; it&#8217;s the indoctrinated, brainwashed, cowed followers that have no voice to fight back under threat of death due to apostasy.  We need to make the world safe again for critical thinking and freedom of expression.</p>
<p>Time to get the Federation to fight the Borg of religious monopoly on an individual&#8217;s rights to think differently and question.</p>
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		<title>By: Maharishi</title>
		<link>http://www.jesusandmo.net/2008/02/22/raft/#comment-156177</link>
		<dc:creator>Maharishi</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 02 Oct 2009 07:54:42 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.jesusandmo.net/2008/02/22/raft/#comment-156177</guid>
		<description>BEst ..  

This one is my favorite .. 

Sadly this is the cause of the most ordinary people to keep holding on to faith, they think that belief can be justified as being something untouchable by logic and therfore to comepletely neglect rationality. Sad :( :::::</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>BEst ..  </p>
<p>This one is my favorite .. </p>
<p>Sadly this is the cause of the most ordinary people to keep holding on to faith, they think that belief can be justified as being something untouchable by logic and therfore to comepletely neglect rationality. Sad <img src='http://www.jesusandmo.net/wp-includes/images/smilies/icon_sad.gif' alt=':(' class='wp-smiley' />  :::::</p>
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		<title>By: Thomas Ash</title>
		<link>http://www.jesusandmo.net/2008/02/22/raft/#comment-85486</link>
		<dc:creator>Thomas Ash</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 31 May 2008 15:58:16 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.jesusandmo.net/2008/02/22/raft/#comment-85486</guid>
		<description>Just for the record, pace Gjerstad, Mackie doesn&#039;t discuss Plantinga&#039;s reformed epistemology at all.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Just for the record, pace Gjerstad, Mackie doesn&#8217;t discuss Plantinga&#8217;s reformed epistemology at all.</p>
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	<item>
		<title>By: yelinna</title>
		<link>http://www.jesusandmo.net/2008/02/22/raft/#comment-76970</link>
		<dc:creator>yelinna</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 29 Mar 2008 01:41:27 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.jesusandmo.net/2008/02/22/raft/#comment-76970</guid>
		<description>Do I have that raft thing if I become buddhist?</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Do I have that raft thing if I become buddhist?</p>
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		<title>By: Nik</title>
		<link>http://www.jesusandmo.net/2008/02/22/raft/#comment-74774</link>
		<dc:creator>Nik</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 04 Mar 2008 22:32:15 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.jesusandmo.net/2008/02/22/raft/#comment-74774</guid>
		<description>I don&#039;t know about you guys, but my favorite line was &quot;But... I don&#039;t know Latin&quot;</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I don&#8217;t know about you guys, but my favorite line was &#8220;But&#8230; I don&#8217;t know Latin&#8221;</p>
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		<title>By: Nathan Bond</title>
		<link>http://www.jesusandmo.net/2008/02/22/raft/#comment-74168</link>
		<dc:creator>Nathan Bond</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 28 Feb 2008 18:46:50 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.jesusandmo.net/2008/02/22/raft/#comment-74168</guid>
		<description>What&#039;s all this about senseless divinitatis?</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>What&#8217;s all this about senseless divinitatis?</p>
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	<item>
		<title>By: Gjerstad</title>
		<link>http://www.jesusandmo.net/2008/02/22/raft/#comment-74158</link>
		<dc:creator>Gjerstad</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 28 Feb 2008 17:08:09 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.jesusandmo.net/2008/02/22/raft/#comment-74158</guid>
		<description>@Dick M: &quot;Can you please elaborate re Mackie and Plantinga? Gramatically, if you will.&quot;

What does &quot;re&quot; mean? And you want me to elaborate &quot;gramatically&quot;... what? Gramatically correct, perhaps?
J. L. Mackie was an australian philosopher (yada yada, go check wikipedia) who wrote the book &quot;The Miracle of Theism&quot; in which he, with sublime logic, criticize all the classical arguments for God&#039;s existence and some new ones (even a Kierkegaardian standpoint). I highly recommend it and his &quot;Ethics: Inventing right and wrong&quot;. Mackie was surely a superior logician, compared to Plantinga.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>@Dick M: &#8220;Can you please elaborate re Mackie and Plantinga? Gramatically, if you will.&#8221;</p>
<p>What does &#8220;re&#8221; mean? And you want me to elaborate &#8220;gramatically&#8221;&#8230; what? Gramatically correct, perhaps?<br />
J. L. Mackie was an australian philosopher (yada yada, go check wikipedia) who wrote the book &#8220;The Miracle of Theism&#8221; in which he, with sublime logic, criticize all the classical arguments for God&#8217;s existence and some new ones (even a Kierkegaardian standpoint). I highly recommend it and his &#8220;Ethics: Inventing right and wrong&#8221;. Mackie was surely a superior logician, compared to Plantinga.</p>
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		<title>By: Hamidreza</title>
		<link>http://www.jesusandmo.net/2008/02/22/raft/#comment-74059</link>
		<dc:creator>Hamidreza</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 28 Feb 2008 02:21:14 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.jesusandmo.net/2008/02/22/raft/#comment-74059</guid>
		<description>&lt;i&gt;The unexamined belief is not worth believing&lt;/i&gt;

Once examined it is no longer a &quot;belief&quot;.  So the above sentence uses the wrong terminology.  Belief by definition means unexamined.  It should say:

The unexamined belief is not worth accepting.

If you examine a theory and accept it, you are not believing in it - you are accepting it.  If you accept it without examination, then you are believing it.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p><i>The unexamined belief is not worth believing</i></p>
<p>Once examined it is no longer a &#8220;belief&#8221;.  So the above sentence uses the wrong terminology.  Belief by definition means unexamined.  It should say:</p>
<p>The unexamined belief is not worth accepting.</p>
<p>If you examine a theory and accept it, you are not believing in it &#8211; you are accepting it.  If you accept it without examination, then you are believing it.</p>
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	<item>
		<title>By: Hamidreza</title>
		<link>http://www.jesusandmo.net/2008/02/22/raft/#comment-74056</link>
		<dc:creator>Hamidreza</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 28 Feb 2008 02:15:20 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.jesusandmo.net/2008/02/22/raft/#comment-74056</guid>
		<description>Hobbes, again you are generalizing without attention to the complexities.  Lets put it this way.  Chritianity has a spectrum from red to violet.  Islam has a spectrum from blue to violet.  They are both spectrums, but Islam is right to ultra-right wing (since you are so fond of left-to-right stuff).

Most Muslims are radical in thought.  Except for the westernized Muslims (which you Postcolonial Leftists like to call the unauthentic self-hating &quot;Uncle Toms&quot;), the rest of Muslims believe in the infalliability and absolutism of the Koran and Prophet Mohammad (Peace be upon this Assassin).  Now few of Muslims act on their radical thoughts - (which is good.)  That is why the activist Muslims or Islamists can commit severe acts of illiberalism (such as misogyny) and terrorism, and they are never condemned by the majority of Muslims.

Funny thing is why the supposedly tolerant cultural Leftists accept such hatred, intolerance, discrimination and oppression of Muslims (and infidels) by Muslims.  I have never seen a poco/pomo Leftist criticize Islamic nonsense or its criminal Prophet - and therefore it is fair to say that Leftists support intolerance, misogyny and oppression by Muslims.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Hobbes, again you are generalizing without attention to the complexities.  Lets put it this way.  Chritianity has a spectrum from red to violet.  Islam has a spectrum from blue to violet.  They are both spectrums, but Islam is right to ultra-right wing (since you are so fond of left-to-right stuff).</p>
<p>Most Muslims are radical in thought.  Except for the westernized Muslims (which you Postcolonial Leftists like to call the unauthentic self-hating &#8220;Uncle Toms&#8221;), the rest of Muslims believe in the infalliability and absolutism of the Koran and Prophet Mohammad (Peace be upon this Assassin).  Now few of Muslims act on their radical thoughts &#8211; (which is good.)  That is why the activist Muslims or Islamists can commit severe acts of illiberalism (such as misogyny) and terrorism, and they are never condemned by the majority of Muslims.</p>
<p>Funny thing is why the supposedly tolerant cultural Leftists accept such hatred, intolerance, discrimination and oppression of Muslims (and infidels) by Muslims.  I have never seen a poco/pomo Leftist criticize Islamic nonsense or its criminal Prophet &#8211; and therefore it is fair to say that Leftists support intolerance, misogyny and oppression by Muslims.</p>
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	<item>
		<title>By: Hobbes</title>
		<link>http://www.jesusandmo.net/2008/02/22/raft/#comment-73919</link>
		<dc:creator>Hobbes</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 27 Feb 2008 12:07:57 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.jesusandmo.net/2008/02/22/raft/#comment-73919</guid>
		<description>Hamidreza, you missed my point. I can&#039;t believe you were Muslim and don&#039;t see what I&#039;m saying. EVERY religion has its spectrum of believers. If your argument were correct, every Muslim is as radical as the worst. Of course there are a lot of differences between Islam and Christianity. Structurally, they are quite the same (radical to liberal). I&#039;ve seen that myself.

Chill, my friend.

&lt;i&gt;The unexamined belief is not worth believing&lt;/i&gt;</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Hamidreza, you missed my point. I can&#8217;t believe you were Muslim and don&#8217;t see what I&#8217;m saying. EVERY religion has its spectrum of believers. If your argument were correct, every Muslim is as radical as the worst. Of course there are a lot of differences between Islam and Christianity. Structurally, they are quite the same (radical to liberal). I&#8217;ve seen that myself.</p>
<p>Chill, my friend.</p>
<p><i>The unexamined belief is not worth believing</i></p>
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